You can listen to this podcast episode here.
Jess: Hello, and welcome to Queer Talk - the University of Winchester’s first LGBT podcast. For the purposes of this podcast, we will be shortening the LGBTQ+ acronym to LGBT.
Lee: Hi, my name is Lee.
Jess: And my name is Jess.
Lee: And welcome to our second podcast. So, today we’re going to be talking about Hampshire Pride, which was on the 23rd of February – and it was amazing. I had a great time. It was Jess’s first time at Pride.
Jess: Whoo.
Lee: So what did you think?
Jess: Yeah…I really enjoyed it. It felt nice to kind of be part of something I guess? ’Cos I always thought about going to Pride, but like, as an ally, it’s kind of… not awkward - awkward’s the wrong word. But like…um…I don’t know really!
{Laughs nervously}
Jess: But yeah, I had a lot of fun. I really liked marching in the parade, seeing all the stalls and stuff, getting a lot of merch – probably spent too much. I mean, everyone spends too much at Pride!
Lee: Yeah, I feel like with Pride there’s quite a lot to choose from.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: Especially when it comes to spending money – it’s not just ‘How much money am I going to spend?’ It’s ‘Which bits am I gonna spend it on?’
Jess: Literally.
Lee: This year we had some alcoholic beverages available, before the actual parade itself. Which I did not see last year, which was interesting. But it was quite a family-friendly environment regardless. Because it was a nice area outside the Great Hall. Piecaramba! was there – they do amazing pies and they were doing takeaway pies - at a really good price actually. Had one of those. Didn’t have one of the alcoholic beverages – I prefer not to, at like, 12 o’clock!
Jess: I also like, in terms of the family-friendly elements, they had like a little library corner, and they were reading children’s stories about – I think – LGBT issues?
Lee: Yeah. And they had some like entertaining, circus equipment?
Jess: Oh yeah! I nearly went over but thought I’m probably a bit old for this.
{Both laugh}
Lee: They had like plate-spinning and stuff like that – those little things that you juggle on a string.
Jess: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh – they had live music from the Busking Society.
Lee: Oh yeah, that was brilliant. They did a really good job – I can’t believe they sang for so long! They must’ve been exhausted, but they did a really good job. It was really cool.
Jess: And there was another choir…? I have no idea who they were, but…
Lee: Um, I think it was…I know it was a Gay Men’s choir…I think it might’ve been either Winchester or Hampshire Gay Men’s Choir. [It was the Solent Gay Men’s Chorus].
Jess: Oh cool.
Lee: Not entirely sure…but they were really cool as well.
Jess: Yeah – oh it was a lovely day as well, wasn’t it? Boiling.
Lee: It was really warm.
Jess: Absolutely roasting.
{Jess laughs}
Lee: I prefer that over it being cold though.
Jess: Oh yeah…it was really nice.
Lee: So what did you think of the indoor market?
Jess: Is that the bit…before or after…?
Lee: After the parade.
Jess: Yeah…I really enjoyed it – I mean, I was quite surprised to see some companies there, like The Scouts – I was a bit like why…?
Lee: Yeah, I was a bit surprised at first, but I guess that’s kind of promoting their stance on diversity.
Jess: Oh, okay.
Lee: Because in the past obviously it’s been quite segregated – hasn’t it? It’s been like ‘girls have a certain thing’, ‘boys have a certain thing’ - it’s all separated.
Jess: Oh, I see.
Lee: And they’re all kind of highlighting that they except you no matter what your identity.
Jess: Oh, that’s nice.
Lee: Yeah, it’s cool. It’s nice to be able to have an organisation that helps kids learn skills, but that is also completely friendly.
Jess: Yeah, that makes a lot more sense now. ‘Cos they asked me ‘Do you want to volunteer?’ and I was like ‘sure’. So…
{Both laugh}
Jess: Yeah, um…who else was there? Like the ‘smoke alarm people’ were there.
Lee: Yeah, the fire brigade were there.
Jess: Oh, the fire brigade yeah, ‘cos like the fire truck led the procession.
Lee: Yeah, the fire truck kind of followed the parade round, like near the front? But not quite.
Jess: Yeah. I was sad they didn’t put the siren on - I was like ‘aww’.
{Both laugh}
Lee: I think there were more charity stalls more than last year, which was cool.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: I saw Mermaids there which was really cool. I saw quite a few different charities from local areas as well as kind of…not national, but… a little bit wider than local.
Jess: Yeah. Like Scouts and stuff.
Lee: Yeah.
Jess: There was a cool stand that - I think they were like youth volunteers – and you could make your own badge.
Lee: That was cool.
Jess: So, I got an ally badge – I was like ‘Yay!’
{Both laugh}
Lee: Yeah, they had some really cool badges that you could make yourself. You just chose the piece of paper that went into the badge, and they had a bunch of them. It was pretty cool.
Jess: Yeah. I think I had one of those machines when I was a kid, but I ran out of the badge stuff. So I was like ‘oh’. Cry.
Lee: There was more like entertainment overall than last year, which was really cool. I do feel like every time Pride happens it gets better.
Jess: Yeah. I mean, it was my first one, so I can’t really say but…
{Both laugh}
Lee: Yeah, it’s one of those things that the more experience you have, like, doing this kind of event the better it gets I suppose. And I mean I take my hat off to the people that organised it.
Jess: Oh god, yeah.
Lee: I know that Sarah-Louise is part of the university, and she was essentially leading Pride.
Jess: Was she the one taking pictures, or…?
Lee: Sarah was the one who kind of standing out up front.
Jess: Oh, did she do the speech?
Lee: She did one of the speeches yeah. It was really cool to see so many people supporting as well.
Jess: Yeah, it was a really nice atmosphere – like really friendly – like I didn’t feel like I was out of place, I felt like I was part of something. Which was really nice, especially walking in the parade. With a little flag like ‘Whoo!’.
{Both laugh}
Lee: It would have been nicer to see a little bit more variety amongst the stalls, but working with such limited space…as you saw it was a bit, kind of, cramped.
Jess: Yeah… Some stalls had to come like later in the day and it was still…
Lee: …still a bit cramped.
Jess: There was like the – was it the Alternative music people?
Lee: Oh yeah, the Queer Alternative. They’re pretty cool, they’re a group based in Hampshire, but they’re kind of like a national group. Who focus on kind of creating a nice atmosphere for Queer people who are into Alternative music and fashion. So kind of like the goths, the rockers, punks, emos – that kind of atmosphere.
Jess: Yeah, they were playing ‘Holiday’ when we were marching.
{Both laugh}
Lee: Yeah, that was fun. They did play some pretty cool music throughout the parade, and before the parade – that was nice to hear.
Jess: Yeah, when we were all lining up ready to go…it was fun.
Lee: I went to the After Party, after the parade. That was…I really enjoyed it – it was definitely very different than last year. I felt like last year there were a lot more people there, but this year I think that rather than focusing on the amount of people that they would get to turn up, they focused on the quality. So, I felt like the entertainment was higher quality. Adam All and Apple Derriere were there again and they were amazing. And they’ve just got married!
Jess: Oh!
Lee: Which was really cool.
Jess: Fair enough.
{Jess laughs}
Jess: Are they like a drag act…?
Lee: Yeah, they’re a drag couple.
Jess: Aww, that’s cute.
Lee: So, a drag king and a drag queen.
Jess: Oh.
Lee: Yeah, it’s really nice to see that kind of expression. I will admit one of their performances in particular was quite emotional.
Jess: Aww.
Lee: Just because I knew the relationship between them, and aww it was so cute.
Jess: Kind of wish I’d been there now.
{Both laugh}
Lee: There were some brilliant DJs…um…I don’t particularly know the names of the DJs, but they were both amazing. There were a couple of tables on the dancefloor, which was pretty different for an SU-run event. But then I suppose it was more SU-hosted rather than run. But it didn’t take up room that was needed, which was cool.
Jess: Yeah. I guess it’s more performance-based than dancing…?
Lee: Yeah, there was a fair amount of…kind of time to dance.
Jess: Ah, okay.
Lee: But it was mostly performance.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: Yeah. So today we’re going to be focusing on the spectrums and the three parts of the community.
Jess: So, the three parts of the community we’re discussing today are sexual orientation, gender identity and romantic orientation. Yes. So, I know a little about sexual orientation just because…I don’t know…I guess it’s the one that most people kind of know?
Lee: Yeah, it’s most of the acronym.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: So, I think people just think of the acronym, so they think of sexuality first.
Jess: Yeah. Gender identity and then a little bit on, because it’s in the last podcast – go listen that if you haven’t already – whoo. Then romantic orientation I guess I know the least about? Like I’m not very informed. Is that like…demi and stuff? Or…?
Lee: It’s kind of related to the asexual spectrum. So, romantic orientation is literally the basis of romantic attraction.
Jess: Oh, okay.
Lee: So, you’ve got sexual attraction which is sexual orientation and then romantic attraction which is romantic orientation. So it’s just like another level.
Jess: So yeah, let’s start with sexual orientation. So, heterosexual – that’s what I am. So heterosexual is when the direction of one’s sexual attraction toward the opposite sex/gender, which is what I am.
Lee: And we covered LGB last time, but I’ll just reiterate. You’ve got lesbian, gay and bisexual. So, lesbian is another way of…you can use it interchangeably if you’re a female who is attracted to females. You may identify as lesbian or gay. Because gay just means that you’re attracted to the same gender. And then bisexual is being attracted to one or more genders.
Jess: And then pansexual is sexual desire or attraction that is not limited to people of a particular gender identity or sexual orientation.
Lee: That’s an interesting one, because a lot of people argue that it’s very similar to bisexual.
Jess: So is the difference like - I mean it’s probably quite difficult to determine the difference – but is it like um…boys, girls and then like…trans people? Or…?
Lee: It’s um, you could almost consider it to be gender blind.
Jess: Oh, okay.
Lee: So…um, a lot of people who are bisexual will argue that pansexual is the same thing. Umm…
Jess: Hmmm…
{Both laugh}
Lee: It’s more of community thing. Bisexual – it kind of existed first as a term, but the concepts have always been there. So it’s just a matter of someone’s kind of preference to what they would like to label themselves.
Jess: Oh, okay.
Lee: Then we have omnisexual which is sexual attraction in many or unlimited ways towards people of any number of identities. Very similar again, but it is very different as well. So…you can probably tell from the way that’s it’s described that “unlimited ways” is essentially another way of saying that…it’s an interesting attitude towards sexual attraction. In that it’s like a ‘don’t care’ attitude. Like it’s really, really casual, kind of blasé ‘gender doesn’t matter’ at all.
Jess: Right…but that’s not the same as pansexual?
Lee: It’s not the same as pansexual, no.
Jess: Okay, so is it like…gender things that are more internal? Than visible? If that makes sense? Or…?
Lee: Yeah, I would argue that yeah that’s probably the case.
Jess: And then there’s polysexual. The sexual attraction to more than one gender, with no limit on the gender spectrum.
Lee: This isn’t to be confused with polyamorous. Which is being in relationships of more than two people.
Jess: Oh yeah.
{Jess laughs}
Lee: So, a lot of people think ‘Oh, if you’re polysexual that means that you get into those relationships’. No, if you’re polyamorous you have a tendency to get into those relationships. But polysexual is kind of an umbrella term that means you kind of are sexually attracted to multiple genders. So, there’s no limit on the gender spectrum.
Jess: So is that like an umbrella term for pansexual and omnisexual – or not?
Lee: Yeah, it can be. A lot of people use that as an umbrella term rather than a specific label. But it’s kind of like ‘queer’ in the way that I use queer as a label specifically for me. But it can be used as an umbrella term as well.
Jess: Ah, I see.
Lee: Then we have asexual. In general, those who identify as asexual experience little to no sexual attraction toward others. The ‘Ace Spectrum’ is a term used to describe the varying levels of sexual attraction of people who identify as asexual or demisexual or graysexual. There’s many different ones. I will not go through all of them because it is a spectrum.
Jess: Okay.
Lee: So, essentially, ace is referring to someone who experiences little to no sexual attraction.
Jess: And then demisexual is similar? But it’s generally described as not experiencing any sexual attraction to another person until a greater bond is formed. So, I guess like if you started dating, and then further along the line, and then you’d find them sexually attractive.
Lee: Yeah, pretty much. The romantic stuff generally falls in line first.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: So you get the friend feelings, the romantic feelings, then the sexual feelings.
Jess: Ah-ha.
Lee: Rather than people who are not demisexual might be sexually attracted to celebrities and stuff like that. Typically demisexuals aren’t experiencing that.
Jess: Ah, okay.
Lee: Then we are moving onto gender identity. So this is quite a close subject for me and there are so many gender identities. So I haven’t listed a whole bunch of them. As most people will probably know, or you may not, Facebook has about – well, over – 50 gender identities that you can choose from on your profile.
Jess: Oh, I didn’t know that.
Lee: Yeah, it might actually be longer now – the list. But yeah they have quite a lot of genders you can choose from to identify as on Facebook. Which is cool.
Jess: Yeah, I guess I didn’t know that as I made my account when I was like 13 and I haven’t really looked at it since.
Lee: Yeah.
{Both laugh}
Lee: It’s pretty cool.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: It’s a point of annoyance for people who don’t get gender identity.
Jess: Oh.
Lee: They’re like ‘Oh why have you got so many options?’ And it’s like ‘Oh, but they’re not “options” though’. Not really.
Jess: It’s not like ‘Oooh, what do I feel today?’ It’s like no.
Lee: Yeah – in real life they’re not options.
Jess: No.
Lee: So we’re gonna talk first about the difference between sex and gender. So that you can properly understand what gender identity means.
Jess: So, sex is based on our biology, from our DNA to our reproductive organs.
Lee: Gender, or specifically gender identity is a person’s internal sense on being male, female, or some combination of male and female, or neither male or female.
Jess: Cisgender can be defined as relating to or being a person whose gender identity corresponds with the sex the person had or was identified as having at birth. So that’s me I guess? ‘Cos I keep seeing the term cisgender and I’m like – is that me? But yes, it is.
Lee: It can also be shortened to cis. Generally it’s much easier to say ‘cis’ or ‘trans’ person. Generally there’s three terms that are used, which are cis, trans and non-binary which we will get into next. To explain the term non-binary you first need to understand what is meant by gender binary. So a binary itself can be defined as a division into two groups or classes that are considered diametrically opposite. So, females are opposite to males – that kind of thinking. So that’s what the binary is. The gender binary is male and female being opposite ends. So the gender spectrum is explaining what is in between, or what is outside of those two genders. So it explains, or describes, the male and female genders as not fixed places, but more of an influence. Kind of like feminisation or masculinisation. Non-binary, however, is defined as relating to or being a person who identifies with or expresses a gender identity that is neither entirely male nor entirely female.
Jess: The term trans is an umbrella term used to describe people whose gender is not the same as, or does not sit comfortably with, the sex they were assigned at birth. This can cover many gender identities not just the labels transgender and transsexual.
Lee: As an identity, intergender can be considered to be between male and female, or to be a combination of the two. This label is most often adopted by those who are intersex, a biological combination of both male and female characteristics. Which is an identity that we covered in our last our last episode.
Jess: Genderfluid is a gender identity which refers to a gender which varies over time?
Lee: Yeah, so it changes depending on circumstance, time, how they’re feeling…multiple factors.
Jess: Okay.
Lee: Then we have genderqueer which is used as an umbrella term with a similar meaning to non-binary. It can be used to describe any gender identities other than man and woman, thus outside of the gender binary. Some genderqueer people use that as their only description of their gender identity, while others also identify as another gender identity. So, that might seem a little bit confusing, but non-binary is the same in that you can use two kind of…you can use it as a modifier almost. So you can say…um…you’re a non-binary trans person.
Jess: Okay.
Lee: So, you’re transitioning or you feel like your trans but you’re also non-binary.
Jess: Ah, okay.
Lee: Or you can say…you’re genderqueer and trans. Or genderqueer and any other gender.
Jess: Oh, okay.
Jess: So, in terms of like personal pronouns, would that be…they? For like genderfluid and non-binary.
Lee: Some genderfluid and genderqueer people prefer they/them pronouns. But it’s all about personal preference.
Jess: Ah, okay.
Lee: Genderfluid people often switch between the two…
Jess: So he and she?
Lee: Yeah.
Jess: Okay.
Lee: Not always, but a lot of people who kind of feel like their gender changes, they typically switch pronouns sometimes.
Jess: Ah, okay. Agender is a term which can be literally translated as 'without gender'. It can be seen either as a non-binary gender identity or as a statement of not having a gender identity.
Lee: Then bigender is a gender identity which can be literally translated as 'two genders' or 'double gender'. Bigender people experience exactly two gender identities, either simultaneously or varying between the two. These two gender identities could be male and female but could also include non-binary identities. So it’s a little bit tricky, but there is also a gender identity called trigender which – as you might guess – just means three identities.
Jess: Ah.
Lee: Either existing simultaneously, or varying between them.
Jess: So androgyne is a non-binary gender identity associated with androgyny.
Lee: An-drodge-n-ee.
Jess: An-drodge-n-ee – thank you! Androgynes have a gender which is simultaneously feminine and masculine, although not necessarily in equal amounts.
Lee: So when someone says ‘Oh, that person’s very androgynous’ that’s typically what the identity is.
Jess: Ah. See I’ve heard of androgynous – I just haven’t heard of…
Lee: Yeah, it’s kind of just making that into a gender identity label itself.
Jess: Oh, okay – that makes sense.
Lee: So, there are many different types of expressing gender. Around the world, specifically, there are many, many types. For example, two-spirit. So, a lot of people might have heard of two-spirit. Typically, it’s associated with Native Americans, but originally it is from the… I’m going to butcher this pronunciation… The Navajo tribe. It refers to that culture's traditional third gender, in which a biologically male-born person embodies both the masculine and feminine spirit. So they have two spirits inside of them, literally, and one is masculine and one is feminine, and they may vary in how much power they have over the person. It’s a gender identity that is specific to this culture. An interesting example is, it was shown in the film, and probably the book – I haven’t read the book, I’ve just watched the film, ‘The Miseducation of Cameron Post’, which is a film focusing on one of those conversion camps, like, the religious conversion camps that are supposed to be Christian but are trying to convince the kids that they’re not what they are. And one of the characters is two-spirit, which is pretty cool. They don’t delve into it as much as I suspect the book probably does.
Jess: That’s not the most… There’s a recent film about conversion camps that I listened to a podcast on. But yeah, that’s really interesting.
Jess: We have a few more examples, from different tribes that we’ll probably butcher the names of. We might not go through them all in as much detail as we have, but I found it really interesting that most of these tribes hadn’t had connections to the wider world until like, 200 years ago or so, I think you said.
Lee: Yeah, it varies for literally every single one, because these tribes had been secluded from the world like… It’s kind of how you imagine the Amazonian tribes, for example, weren’t discovered until recently because they literally live in the middle of a massive jungle. We could not find them. So, it took adventurers a little while to find them. I think, unfortunately, a lot of these cultures were not lost but kind of changed, or kind of… Not destroyed, or anything like that.
Jess: Like, modernised?
Lee: But modernised by colonialism and stuff like that, unfortunately.
Jess: Hmm, yeah.
Lee: It had a really bad impact.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: But a lot of these things were… Like, these practises still exist today.
Jess: Oh, Okay.
Lee: A lot of gender expression.
Lee: A lot of people may have heard of the term ‘Ladyboy’.
Jess: Oh yeah.
Lee: (Stereo)typically refers to someone from Thailand. That’s generally… When people think of the term ‘Ladyboy’, they may associate it with someone from Thailand.
Jess: Yeah, ‘cos of media and stuff.
[A/N: The association of ladyboys with Thailand, mentioned here, is not supported by either host, it is simply a discussion of the stereotype created by the media.]
{Laughs}
Lee: Yeah. Some people that live there do actually call themselves ladyboys, but… I want to say it’s pronounced… ka-thoo-ee (kathoey)…
Jess: Yeah, I would say ka-thoo-ee (kathoey), just because it’s fun to say, more than anything.
Lee: Yeah, it is a nice word. It loosely translates as "ladyboys," which is why they use that term. So, it’s a third gender – they are known as being born male but "having a female heart," according to a common Thai saying. They are often referred to as "sago," or a second type of woman.
Jess: Oh.
Lee: So, there’s a lot of culture surrounding this particular gender identity. For example, it encompasses drag queens and other cross-dressers, straight and gay, to effeminate gay males, on one end, and post-operative trans people on the other.
Jess: Oh, Okay. So, they generally work in service jobs as in beauty salons and restaurants but can be found in all professions at all levels of society. Some end up as sex workers, which I guess, is mainly the stereotypical view. But, um, the true tradition holds that true kathoeys are neither male nor female but inhabit the space between genders.
Lee: Yeah, it’s an interesting concept really. But it’s really been, kind of, distorted by mainstream media. I think a lot of people have seen ladyboys almost as some kind of tourist attraction.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: When, in actual fact, it’s just modern society’s poor grasp of their identity. They don’t understand what it means for them and their culture.
Jess: No, because I remember there was a brief segment of The Inbetweeners meeting ladyboys and it’s just like… They make it funny, obviously, because it’s The Inbetweeners, but it’s just not very culturally accurate. But, it’s The Inbetweeners so, yeah…
Jess: There’s a tribe in Madagascar, called the Sekrata, and among the Sekrata, little boys thought to have a feminine appearance were raised as girls (Sakalavas). The Antandroy and Hova – apologies for these pronunciations – called their gender crossers sekrata who, like women, wore their hair long and in decorative knots, inserted silver coins in pierced ears, and wore many bracelets on their arms, wrists and ankles. They considered themselves "real" women, they totally forgot they were born males, and through long practice spoke with a woman's voice.
Lee: So, their efforts really, to be female brought about the belief that they were female. It says a lot about gender identity as a whole.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: I think, that is their gender identity, and that is how they identify because in their mind, that’s their internal belief, so they stretch that to others and the others accept that. Which is a lot more progressive than our society has been.
Jess: Yeah.
{Both laugh}
Lee: There’s quite a few more…
Jess: Not to play devils advocate, but it says if they had a feminine appearance they were then raised as girls. I mean, was that their parents’ choice or?
Lee: I think it’s to do with the actual culture itself, so if you had a feminine boy, you would raise them as a girl.
Jess: Ah, Okay.
Lee: Which is interesting – obviously, if they rejected that, I don’t think they (the parents) would have much of a problem with it.
Jess: Oh good, yeah.
Lee: But if they grew up like that, they probably wouldn’t have a problem with it because it’s not like they’re trying to biologically change. Whereas, in this country, for example – this is where a lot of the controversy comes from – if someone wants to transition, they come out as trans, for example, at the age of like, five and they realise they’re transgender. They say to their parents, “I want to change my body. I don’t have the right body parts.” So their parents agree to start them on Hormone Replacement Therapy at the age where they begin puberty. Maybe, later on in life, they go, “Actually, I didn’t really want that.” That is a lot of people’s fear.
Jess: Ah, I see.
Lee: They fear that that happens. Whereas, in a culture like this, for example, they have the opportunity to kind of leave that life behind because it’s not changed anything physically about them, other than maybe their voice.
Jess: Yeah.
Lee: I think after years of practising a female voice, it would take quite a while to masculinise.
Jess: Yeah, I think if you’re taking years and years to practise a female voice, you do want to be a female.
Lee: Yeah.
Jess: Yeah, so that’s all good. Just noticed that, not to play devil’s advocate, like I said.
{Laughs}
Jess: So, the term meti is an indigenous term for a third gender in Nepal with a long and checkered history in the Himalayan region. They are born as males but assume feminine dress and carriage. So, for the last 30 years, most Metis made their living as prostitutes. They do not consider themselves gay, but rather as a third gender that is interested in straight men. In recent years they have been the targets of violence by Napalese police and gangs calling themselves "Maoists."
Lee: Yeah. Unfortunately, that’s one of the more brutal examples of their long-traditional culture being rejected by modern society.
Jess: Oh that’s… Surely, if it’s part of their culture… I mean, obviously you can still reject old things, like there’s old teachings of the Bible that people are just like, no that’s not right.
Lee: Yeah, there’s a lot of things in the past that should be left in the past, but this isn’t harming anyone.
Jess: No.
Lee: I mean, it might be… It’s not great that all of them, well not all of them, but some of them have been known to make a living in the past as prostitutes, because that’s dangerous for them and, obviously the police probably don’t want that many people working in that profession.
Jess: Oh, I see, yeah.
Lee: But for them to specifically target this type of person…
Jess: Yeah, especially violence, it’s just so… Unnecessary doesn’t sound big enough, but you know what I mean.
Lee: Yeah.
Jess: I think it’s just so stupid, is the word.
Lee: Do you have any questions about gender or..?
Jess: I guess it’s going to take me a while to learn all of these terms because there are so many new terms coming to light, and all the time they’re changing, as you were saying.
Lee: Yeah, definitely. I mean, with gender it’s all about the label that fits you best. I suppose it’s not just gender as well, it’s sexual orientation, romantic orientation. It’s all about the label that fits you best, and that’s why there are so many, because there are millions of people over the world that identify as something other than cisgender and straight.
Jess: Yeah, ‘cos I read an article, like, saying that our generation is the most gay. But I think there’s just more terms for people to be like, that’s me. Because before, like, I don’t know, transgender probably wasn’t as widely identified back in our parents’ generation, I guess.
Lee: Yeah, definitely. More people have been admitted to the Gender Identity Clinics in this country in recent years than any other years previous. Specifically in the last two years, the rates in which people have referred themselves, essentially, has pretty much doubled.
Jess: Yeah, it’s not like everyone just suddenly became gay.
{Laughs}
Lee: Yeah, it’s just that more people are comfortable with coming out.
Jess: Yeah, that’s nice!
Lee: So, to cover romantic orientation, it’s quite a simple concept once you get your head around it. If you just separate sexual and romantic feelings, it’s just that in labelled form.
Jess: Okay.
Lee: So, some examples: heteroromantic – you can probably guess what it is because you literally just replace the ‘sexual’ in most identities, for sexual orientation, and you have a romantic orientation. That is it.
Jess: So, I don’t want to get too technical, but how can you tell what’s sexual attraction and what’s romantic attraction?
Lee: I mean, that’s a really good question. Romantic attraction can be… You can actually confuse friendship for romantic attraction, unfortunately.
Jess: I’m not surprised about that one.
{Both laugh}
Lee: That’s one of the things about growing up, I’m afraid, just learning tat one. But, um, with sexual attraction it is a physical thing. So, your body has biological responses of arousal towards other humans, when you feel like you would want to engage in sexual relations. If you have any of these, essentially, symptoms of arousal around someone then that means you feel sexual attraction towards them.
Jess: Ah, Okay.
Lee: So, it’s more to do with the physical acts of intimacy rather than the romantic acts. For example, if you were to, like, hold hands, write each other romantic cards, go out on dates, have long chats and just, you know, that kind of thing. That’s all romantic and it’s all up to different people’s interpretations.
Jess: Yeah. So, essentially, if you want to hold someone’s hand, it’s romantic. If you want something a bit more, it’s probably sexual.
{Laughs}
Lee: Yeah, if you want something that’s attempting to elicit a physical reaction out of the other person or yourself, then it’s probably sexual.
Jess: Okay.
{Both laugh}
Lee: So, there’s like heteroromantic, homoromantic, biromantic, panromantic. So, you take the beginnings of all of the words we’ve covered previously. If you go to our glossary, a lot of these terms are on there. So, we have a blog called Queer Talk, (which was) at queertalkpodcast.blogspot. We will be transferring over to a different blogging platform (You can now find us here), but we will leave that address up and running for a while with a note to our new website. Which we have not yet created (We have now!). So, keep a look out on our SoundCloud profile basically, it will definitely be there. So, if you are interested, and you go to the blogspot and it’s not there, don’t freak out, just go to our SoundCloud profile, it’ll be in the description.
Jess: Yeah, and we’ll probably advertise it on social media and stuff I assume.
Lee: Yeah, definitely.
Jess: Don’t worry, you won’t miss out.
Lee: I’d like to talk a little bit about our supporter / advocate for this podcast, which is Splendid Fred Records. So, not the blog, but the podcast itself is essentially supported by Splendid Fred Records, which is the record company for The University of Winchester. These guys are really cool, they’ve been doing a lot of advocating for change, specifically climate change is one that they’ve had a big focus on.
Jess: Yeah, I think there’s a song, or something, on it?
Lee: They have got a whole album of songs.
Jess: Oh, wow!
Lee: Yeah. They’ve also done spoken word. Oh, they also did an art exhibition that they, kind of, hosted which was pretty cool.
Jess: Yeah! I didn’t know they did that.
Lee: Yeah. They also run a magazine. So, it’s really cool for both students and people outside of the university because they’re just kind of giving a media platform for people to get the very, little-known things out there. But also, to make a change.
Jess: Yeah. I think they’re always accepting submissions if you have anything you want to submit to them.
Lee: Yeah, we’ll put a link in the description for this podcast episode, for the submission to Splendid Fred. If you are interested in doing that, they have the Splendid Fred Magazine website and if you are interested in working with them, perhaps musically or with spoken word, then also get in touch.
Jess: Yeah!
Lee: So, this has been a great podcast. It’s been really nice to talk about Pride – reliving that.
Jess: Yeah, it was a great day. I couldn’t recommend it highly enough as, like… I don’t want to say, “even if you are an ally”, that sounds really bad. But if you’re an ally, or someone who’s never been to Pride, I would encourage you to go, it’s just a really nice atmosphere – definitely worth experiencing at least once.
Lee: Yeah.
Jess: Regardless of when you go to a big one like Brighton, or like a more low-key one like Hampshire. Whatever’s right for you, you know.
Lee: Yeah, there are so many Prides across the UK now. You just have to keep an eye out. Some are free to attend, some are paid for. The more local ones, the more small-scale ones tend to be free, like Hampshire Pride’s free to attend. It’s just the little bits and pieces that you can spend your money on that cost.
Jess: You can literally just turn up and not spend anything, it’s just fun to.
Lee: Yeah, and it’s fun to show your support. I mean, we went and had a meal at a restaurant that was offering 15% off if you wore rainbow.
Jess: Yeah, that was fun, I enjoyed that.
{Laughs}
Lee: So, highly encourage people to attend a Pride. If you feel you want to support the community or are part of the community and you just want to, kind of, be with others who understand and respect you. It’s a really good atmosphere.
Lee: So, thank you from me for listening to this podcast.
Jess: And thank you from me, and I hope you tune in next time!
Lee: Thank you!
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